Welsh co-lead responds to PCCs debate on the devolution of policing in Wales

21 November 2023

Services provided by the police in Wales must not suffer if there is a change to the country’s policing model, says the Police Federation of England and Wales (PFEW) Welsh co-lead.

Zac Mader said PFEW held a neutral position on merging the four forces in Wales into one and on devolving police powers to the Welsh Government - but that any changes must not impact the service.

He said: “As a Federation, while we take a keen interest in the issue, we believe it’s for those elected to public office and for our policy and decision makers to debate it and come to a conclusion.

“However, if the two happened at the same time - the devolution of policing in Wales and the merging of all four forces - we have concerns that this could be an extremely challenging and overwhelming time for all those involved, including the thousands of officers it would impact.”

Zac, a serving police officer who is currently elected to the PFEW National Board, explained that policing 'should always prioritise service over structure'.

He added: “And whatever the outcome, we feel very strongly that policing in Wales shouldn’t be damaged under any new structure and that any changes should be made to improve the service we provide.

“Of course, we will continue to reflect on this debate when further evidence is put forward from all parties.”

Zac’s comments follow a discussion in Westminster on the four Welsh forces being merged into one and the devolution of police powers in Wales.

The country’s four Police and Crime Commissioners (PCCs) appeared before the cross-party Commons Welsh Affairs Committee.

Andy Dunbobbin, the North Wales PCC said: “I’d be for the devolution of policing and criminal justice, however, to have it within one Welsh police force I think would be too much.”

He said such a move would take away from the localised policing approach.

“The more local you can make decisions, we know and evidence suggests, that you’re going to get a better outcome,” he said.

Eleri Thomas, the deputy PCC for Gwent, added: “Having four forces ensures that local connectivity and the focus is very much on delivering for the community, and absolutely maximising the opportunity for collaboration and partnership wherever possible.”

Dafydd Llywelyn, the Dyfed Powys PCC, said a move to one force could see resources redirected from rural communities to urban areas.

He said the first step in any change in the policing model in Wales “would be to see criminal justice and policing devolved to Welsh Government”.

“From there you would decide and dictate the operational model, and it might be that we think we need more than four forces or we could rationalise, whether that be one force, two forces or whatever the model might be,” he said.

“The other thing that’s important is the systems and back-office functions and facilities that underpin the forces.

“People don’t realise that police forces often have different computer systems, HR systems, and finance systems.

“A lot of work needs to be done, in my opinion, to try to rationalise and bring those systems and processes together and from there, efficiencies could naturally happen without having to fundamentally change the structures of the forces."

The South Wales PCC Alun Michael, said: “I quote Sir Tom Winsor, the former chief inspector of constabulary, who said there is nothing that can be achieved by a merger that can’t be achieved by collaboration.”

He told MPs that moving to one force in Wales would make it difficult for police to collaborate with other organisations.

“The other thing is that I look at it from the point of view of a minister in Welsh Government,” he said.

“If there was devolution of policing, do you want it to be a relationship between one minister and one chief constable rather than four chief constables?

“We have a very lively discussion now with Welsh Government ministers and ministers in the UK Government because there are four voices and we can represent the different needs of the different areas.

“Why would you throw that away?”

Click here to watch the debate.